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Bradley Westfield - majesiu - 08-17-2018

(08-16-2018, 06:04 PM)timeconsumer Wrote:Another legend hanging up the cleats for OCO. The greatest WR to ever play and nobody else is even close. You were an awesome teammate.

[Image: KLIKgZA.png]

Westfield is obviously HoF, but since it was mentioned what about other players?

S1 players especially and to a lesser extent, some of S2 class had already the biggest advantage in sim leagues possible - they didn't have to play against players with higher TPE until the very twilight of their career.

Thus in my opinion only absolutely best of the best among themselves should join HoF and S1 should have his own standards e.g. on this list Westfield, Garden and LeClair stand out. Beneath them there is a tier of Phelps, Weston, Jackson even North and Cook are not that far behind them.

S2 is another debate since Evans ended his career, probably prematurely (even though his raw numbers in shorter span should put him in between surefire tier and the rest mentioned above), Trey Willie also should break some records before he is done in few more seasons.

Bradley Westfield - timeconsumer - 08-17-2018

(08-17-2018, 06:58 AM)majesiu Wrote:Westfield is obviously HoF, but since it was mentioned what about other players?

S1 players especially and to a lesser extent, some of S2 class had already the biggest advantage in sim leagues possible - they didn't have to play against players with higher TPE until the very twilight of their career.

Thus in my opinion only absolutely best of the best among themselves should join HoF and S1 should have his own standards e.g. on this list Westfield, Garden and LeClair stand out. Beneath them there is a tier of Phelps, Weston, Jackson even North and Cook are not that far behind them.

S2 is another debate since Evans ended his career, probably prematurely (even though his raw numbers in shorter span should put him in between surefire tier and the rest mentioned above), Trey Willie also should break some records before he is done in few more seasons.

Well that sword cuts both ways. They also had really bad quarterbacks and bad gameplanning. Here are the S1 receiving stats

[Image: uuxfij7.png]

And S2, yards a little better but TDs still scarce

[Image: 7xgBZ3g.png]

Then you have to consider that these guys didn't get the extra DSFL year of earnings that guys do now, so they started at 50 TPE, not 250. Also, in S1 we didn't have access to as much TPE for the top tier earners as receivers did for S2 and beyond. Pro equipment didn't exist back then. Participation TPE for things like mocks and season predictions weren't there.

I'd say the biggest difference between a S1-S3 WR and the new guys is that we didn't nerf passing yard sliders until after S5, when 8 receivers got more than 1400 yards. You can see around the S7 timeframe how it normalized a little more, but there's still a big gap between the Westfield's and the rest of the pack.

[Image: Z3ikDji.png]

So no, I don't think S1 WRs should be held at a different standard from S2 and S3.

Bradley Westfield - 37thchamber - 08-17-2018

There goes my favourite non-Hawk player in the league. Never did figure out how to stop that guy...

Bradley Westfield - Bwestfield - 08-17-2018

(08-17-2018, 10:58 AM)37thchamber Wrote:There goes my favourite non-Hawk player in the league. Never did figure out how to stop that guy...

If you could get away with it, tripping seemed to work. Smile

Bradley Westfield - majesiu - 08-17-2018

(08-17-2018, 03:13 PM)timeconsumer Wrote:Then you have to consider that these guys didn't get the extra DSFL year of earnings that guys do now, so they started at 50 TPE, not 250. Also, in S1 we didn't have access to as much TPE for the top tier earners as receivers did for S2 and beyond. Pro equipment didn't exist back then. Participation TPE for things like mocks and season predictions weren't there.

Still, it's about relative advantage, there was no class above them that could outshine and blocked their progress purely with more TPE.

But your other arguments were very compelling and it's always nice to learn a few things about league history about the way. It seems indeed that even though football lacks era-adjusted stats raw numbers should allow to paint rather full picture of WRs careers.

As is the case with HoF I guess it will boil down to how many inductees HoF committee will deem necessary since it seems 3 WRs are surefire bet, with 5 slightly below them which just seems a lot for one class and one position to have that status.

Bradley Westfield - Kendrick - 08-17-2018

Let's hope you still aren't counting Jackson's first season as starts or games at WR, if you don't his numbers stack up quite nicely.

Bradley Westfield - Bzerkap - 08-18-2018

Oh wow I missed this one. Crazy stuff

Bradley Westfield - Symmetrik - 08-26-2018

(08-17-2018, 06:58 AM)majesiu Wrote:Westfield is obviously HoF, but since it was mentioned what about other players?

S1 players especially and to a lesser extent, some of S2 class had already the biggest advantage in sim leagues possible - they didn't have to play against players with higher TPE until the very twilight of their career.

Thus in my opinion only absolutely best of the best among themselves should join HoF and S1 should have his own standards e.g. on this list Westfield, Garden and LeClair stand out. Beneath them there is a tier of Phelps, Weston, Jackson even North and Cook are not that far behind them.

S2 is another debate since Evans ended his career, probably prematurely (even though his raw numbers in shorter span should put him in between surefire tier and the rest mentioned above), Trey Willie also should break some records before he is done in few more seasons.

Can't ignore the return stats of a guy like Weston who is #1 in KR yards and #3 in PR, and #1 combined. Weston will pass 10k receiving yards this season and is already over 10k total return yards. Westfield is the only other guy there with 20k total.

Bradley Westfield - AdamS - 08-27-2018

some thoughts

-return yards should definitely be considered for HOF players

-having more WRs in a class than other positions makes sense given that its and lb are the positions that have the most people on the field all the time

-we should have a 2 season wait after a player plays their last game before they're eligible