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+---- Thread: Major Announcements (/showthread.php?tid=8446)
Major Announcements - AsylumParty - 04-24-2018
(04-24-2018, 08:09 PM)ADwyer87 Wrote:huh?What I said initially was that you can't accurately compare someone's work at one position to someone else's work at another position. For instance, if I played RB for 3 seasons and QB for the following 4 seasons, and I played at an above average level as a RB, there's no meaningful way to compare how I performed among other RBs, to the performance of QBs for the first 3 seasons, therefore post-position swap data is the only relevant data.
if a player switched positions, their whole body of work would be taken into account, not just post-position change work. so guys like Akselsen, Blocksdale, Oles will be judged over everything they did. The point is just that they will be judged harsher than normal just by the situation, hence the hypothetical example. My point was essentially that a QB who plays all 7 years asa WB and has 6 HoF seasons, will have a naturally better resume than a guy who plays 3 years at CB/OL/whatever, 4 years at QB, and has 3 HoF seasons at each, 6 overall.
I hope that's not as confusing as I think it is rereading it.
Major Announcements - ralams123 - 04-24-2018
I know this is the NSFL hall of fame but how but will any type of DSFL stats influence, as some players like QB's spend longer there than any other position.
Major Announcements - dropbear - 04-24-2018
@ADwyer87 @iamslm22 if you're going to consider the whole body of work of a player who's switched, then I think the HOF shouldn't have position designations. People should just be in the HOF, not in for any one position.
I also think this opens the door to things like an all-decade (S1 - 10, S11 - 20 etc.) team that does assign by position.
Major Announcements - ADwyer87 - 04-24-2018
(04-24-2018, 07:19 PM)AsylumParty Wrote:What I said initially was that you can't accurately compare someone's work at one position to someone else's work at another position. For instance, if I played RB for 3 seasons and QB for the following 4 seasons, and I played at an above average level as a RB, there's no meaningful way to compare how I performed among other RBs, to the performance of QBs for the first 3 seasons, therefore post-position swap data is the only relevant data.I think i kinda get it. I dont think we would be comparing between players at different positions though?
I hope that's not as confusing as I think it is rereading it.
(04-24-2018, 07:29 PM)BenLongshaw Wrote:@ADwyer87 @iamslm22 if you're going to consider the whole body of work of a player who's switched, then I think the HOF shouldn't have position designations. People should just be in the HOF, not in for any one position.I mean, we could always just put a /
I also think this opens the door to things like an all-decade (S1 - 10, S11 - 20 etc.) team that does assign by position.
Major Announcements - Ben - 04-24-2018
(04-25-2018, 12:37 PM)BenLongshaw Wrote:If you're referring to the offensive line, I think that gets an exemption. But should, for examlple, Boss Tweed get in over another RB if the distinguishing factor is his performance at linebacker? I don't think so
(04-25-2018, 01:29 PM)BenLongshaw Wrote:@ADwyer87 @iamslm22 if you're going to consider the whole body of work of a player who's switched, then I think the HOF shouldn't have position designations. People should just be in the HOF, not in for any one position.
The Bens are in agreement again :cheers:
Major Announcements - sapp2013 - 04-24-2018
(04-24-2018, 07:21 PM)ralams123 Wrote:I know this is the NSFL hall of fame but how but will any type of DSFL stats influence, as some players like QB's spend longer there than any other position.
I don't think it should. It is like college. A player that leaves early is gonna have more seasons of work, where as someone who stays the full 4 years, or 5 if redshirted, isn't going to have as many seasons to gain stats. And college stats are never used when evaluating pro inductees.
Major Announcements - dropbear - 04-24-2018
(04-25-2018, 11:39 AM)ADwyer87 Wrote:I think i kinda get it. I dont think we would be comparing between players at different positions though?
I mean, we could always just put a /
I'm happy with the / as long as it's the HOF for careers, not positions. Having people who have switched muddies the water. Someone could switch position to capitalise on a deficit at their opposing position, i.e. a player going from RB -> WR when a significant portion of the elite secondary players retire or regress and having several seasons of inflated stats compared with someone who was a WR from DSFL to retirement.
Major Announcements - Bayley - 04-24-2018
For me, as a HOF voter, I am going to be looking at the entire body of work for the player. I will look how that person compared to other people who played in that position when they played. I think looking at pure numbers is deceiving because Season 1 could have different stats to Season 3, etc. I will be looking at how that person did comparative to other people at that position.
I am going to be very stingy when it comes to this as I want HOF to be an elite group of people that either changed the position or were that much better. That is my view on HOF as someone that will be voting.
Major Announcements - Beaver - 04-24-2018
(04-24-2018, 06:48 PM)sapp2013 Wrote:^ from WikipediaI considered drawing from the NFL to guide our standard but there are massive differences in the NSFL playerbase and the NFL playerbase.
If 32 teams produce 8 HoFers, 8 teams should produce 2. @Beaver
Somewhere around 1500 players will play in the NFL in any given season while we have, what, 200? 8 of 1500 is 0.5% so if we wanted it truly representative we'd have a maximum of 1 Hall of Famer per season.
But like I said, we don't have near the bottom-of-roster churn that NFL teams go through. Rarely do we have active players that aren't starters so compare the NFL's 800ish starters to our... 80 or so actives? Again that's 1 Hall of Famer max per season.
There isn't really a great analogous way to compare our playerbase to the NFL's so I'd disregard it totally. If we want 2 max per season that's fine and we can try to balance around that but we shouldn't do it just because that gets us kinda close-ish to the NFL HoF.
Major Announcements - Oles - 04-24-2018
Here's my view as someone who position switched. I have no expectation of making the Hall of Fame at this point. I don't care if I am top two over the next 5 seasons for QB, I still don't think I'll make it. Why exactly? Well one, is the switch. When I switched I was coming off 2 mediocre seasons of CB play, my first two seasons were fantastic, and I was very much top 3 in CB rankings imo. The next 2 seasons frankly I sucked. This made the position not fun at all and along with Rove's activity slowing down I talked with him and we made the decision that benefited the team first. When I made that switch I basically said to myself Oles HoF chances are out the window. I expect position switch players that did it of their own choice (OL is a much different scenario) to have a hard time getting in. Boss Tweed to me should be a Hall of Famer, but if he sucks at LB that might discredit his efforts and make him a fringe candidate. I'm fine with not making the Hall of Fame, I did what was best for the Liberty and I'd make that switch 10 times out of 10. Hall of Fame should be an elite club, and to me a position switch player is going to struggle to compare to people who played their first position, and struggle to compare to people who played their second position.