![[DEV] ISFL Forums](http://dev.sim-football.com/forums/images/emerald/logo.png "[DEV] ISFL Forums"){kind=logo}
+- [DEV] ISFL Forums (http://dev.sim-football.com/forums)
+-- Forum: Community (http://dev.sim-football.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?fid=5)
+--- Forum: Discussion (http://dev.sim-football.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?fid=33)
+--- Thread: Carryover TPE (/showthread.php?tid=8372)
Carryover TPE - ADwyer87 - 04-18-2018
(04-17-2018, 03:56 PM)ItsJustBarry Wrote:Also, it probably shouldn't be left to a GM vote anyways but HO is vehemently against taking any proactive actions.What?
As i said, this is something we've been discussing, it's ongoing. And if you think it HASNT been going on for a while, I am sorry but that's not true. It's something I said as a GM, it's something I brought up as soon as I was put into HO, and it's still something I bring up today. That rule that you linked in this thread, that was MY rule summit proposal. It got 3/5ths of HO but only one vote of GMs. We are discussing now taking actions of things like this outside of the rule summit, as we already have with previous cap-related affairs like disallowing GMs to propose their own cap raises. But there are a few things that have made this specific issue tough to deal with:
1) this is uncharted territory. We've never had people get to the top tier of TPE until last season, and have never had regression happen still. So we could make speculations, yes, but that's it, nothing concrete.
2) this is more or less a new HO. I feel like we are more or less in the "second age" of HO, starting with Dermot. I think he would agree things are different from when he joined and now. There's been a lot of turnover in recent times, that's not a secret. Ballerstorm did a great job setting up this league, but he had a lot of things that worked better on paper than in real life, were straight copied from SHL which doesn't carry over the best, or made to work well in the early stages but not as a good way to continue on. We've been working on fixing a lot of these, I've been trying to have a "Spring Cleaning" of sorts for the NSFL, but these aren't all just changes that we can implement overnight. Not only that, but we need to make sure we make GOOD changes. The cap is messed up, I think we're all in agreement there. But we don't want to replace the system with another bad one.
Carryover TPE - ADwyer87 - 04-18-2018
(04-17-2018, 04:34 PM)manicmav36 Wrote:My only concern would be players being priced out of the league. Some postions, say RB for example, aren't nearly as important to some teams as they are to others.The important thing would be for HO to always know the state of the league financially if these certain systems were in place. That way nothing like this would happen. If we saw that people could be priced out, then we would know to raise the cap. Key things like that
Take Owen Taylor for example. What if teams that want a high paid running back can't afford him, and other teams, who don't see the necessity of a good running back, don't want to eat the cost? Would there be a fail-safe in place? E.g. no bids so their minimum is allowed to go lower?
Carryover TPE - ADwyer87 - 04-18-2018
About the OP,
I very much disagree with adding carryover TPE. I think it's best we do not have both carryover TPE and carryover cash. I believe GOMHL does this, but they are a different style of league with an overall TPE cap. I think the way we do it, carryover money, is very nice and still rewards good work. If I had a hard time in my life, couldn't do sim league jobs, dropped fantasy and HO, I would still have enough cash to be a solid earner for a couple seasons thanks to the cash from my many seasons of previous jobs
Carryover TPE - AdamS - 04-18-2018
I will say that in my experience its been GMs who are against pro-activity rather than HO
Carryover TPE - Roly - 04-18-2018
(04-18-2018, 03:50 AM)AdamS Wrote:-Lift the ban on performance bonuses. Let gms use them to sweeten contracts.
I'm curious to why the ban exists?
I've always guessed it was because the sim is fickle and rewarding anything from it would be haphazard or to avoid GMs circumventing the cap. But if bonuses counted against the cap, like most sports leagues, I'm not sure about the second.
I like a lot of the ideas you put out @AdamS. Glad to hear HO was already talking about this area of contracts too.
Carryover TPE - kckolbe - 04-18-2018
(04-18-2018, 07:13 AM)Roly Wrote:I'm curious to why the ban exists?
I've always guessed it was because the sim is fickle and rewarding anything from it would be haphazard or to avoid GMs circumventing the cap. But if bonuses counted against the cap, like most sports leagues, I'm not sure about the second.
I like a lot of the ideas you put out @AdamS. Glad to hear HO was already talking about this area of contracts too.
That ban was in place back when I joined, and I bet it was due to unpredictability. There was no such thing as a likely to be earned bonus, so it would have been pretty chaotic.
Carryover TPE - Jiggly_333 - 04-18-2018
(04-18-2018, 04:33 AM)White Cornerback Wrote:So the bosman ruling from association football then? @Jiggly_333 knows.Barely recognized it, but yeah.
That's the basis of contract expiry deals, right? Basically how MLS has gotten most of it's aging "world class" players.
It would be interesting to implement it here and it would sure cut down on tampering charges, but I think that because we are just one league, there is almost no way to make that sort of deal without intentionally and directly affecting another team. It works in soccer because most of the time it's from one league to another. I don't know how a GM here, say MP, would feel about someone like Boss, having signed a deal with the Yeti in his last contract year, continuing to start for the team until the end of that season.
Carryover TPE - 37thchamber - 04-18-2018
(04-18-2018, 09:50 AM)AdamS Wrote:-Shrink max contracts to 2 seasons for anyone under 500 or 600 tpe (depending on what number a min raise is broken down at), and 3 seasons for anyone under 800 tpe. Even if people are "getting away with it" at the high end, they're still doing so at a much higher level than currently exists.Was gonna suggest something like this. Makes sense to me.
(04-18-2018, 09:50 AM)AdamS Wrote:-Lift the ban on performance bonuses. Let gms use them to sweeten contracts.Not so sure about these. Could work, though.
-Limit each player to one minimum contract during their career. Obviously this would require deciding on a percentage over minimum that the other contracts were required to be.
(04-18-2018, 09:50 AM)AdamS Wrote:-Make players on inactive single season contracts cost an extra 500k every single season they remain on the team. Make the "safe" options less attractive.Probably a more "acceptable" solution than my proposal of having GMs bid on inactives, but I still don't like that a team can extend an inactive indefinitely, tbh.
(04-18-2018, 09:50 AM)AdamS Wrote:-Stop allowing NSFL drafted players that are still in the DSFL to be paid by the DSFL.100%
(04-18-2018, 09:50 AM)AdamS Wrote:-Allow contract renegotiations. It will allow GMs to try to keep their stars as they rise, but also trigger any new minimums.I reckon these two combined could be a game-changer, but the onus is still on the player to seek another contract, no? Since it would be tampering the other way around?
-The last season of a contract is currently the time when teams can negotiate extensions with players. Allow other teams to negotiate with them during this time period. This will create more free agency possibilities and force GMs to work to keep their players a bit more.
Carryover TPE - ItsJustBarry - 04-18-2018
(04-18-2018, 08:06 AM)AdamS Wrote:I will say that in my experience its been GMs who are against pro-activity rather than HO
Now you're trying to play both sides. You've been HO for like 10 minutes but you were a GM voting down pro-activity for multiple seasons. Yes, I see the summit voting every season and I think its ridiculous but I know why GMs don't want to make things "difficult" for themselves. At the same time, HO should recognize certain issues and make an executive decision.
I think Dwyer mentioned salary changes got 3/5 vote in favor from HO but you are still needing 75% GM vote which is never going to happen. Meanwhile, GMs spending $22-30 million on OL bots. Baltimore spent $22.5M on 5 OL bots and only $11.5M on the remaining offensive skill positions. There's a lot of discussion ahead but I think we can agree that something needs to change.
Carryover TPE - Bzerkap - 04-18-2018
@AdamS did you campaign against Bovo's latest attempt to fix the contracts? Because that one does not affect the contract at signing. It is implemented before signing.