S22 Expansion

[sapp2013]

These expansion rules are whack.

Both GM's are taken in the expansion, but the teams still take 12 more players? That's 14 players before one of the largest drafts, and that's not taking into account any free agents they sign. I would have liked to see 8-9 players + GM's.

And they get slotted at the top of the draft order? They should be slotted 3 and 4. Absolutely ruining the teams that expected a high draft pick and may not get their guy/position and will be perpetual bottom feeders.

A team can lose up to 3 of their guys? Whack. I'd like to see that brought down to 2.

HO should take a look at the NBA's expansion rules because our league is most similar to that in terms of contract length and team size.

I know I'm not around a lot, but it also would have been nice to get a decline notice or any kind of notice of my application, but I understand ho is busy and doesn't want to waste energy on someone who stops by once a month to stir the pot.

Aight. See y'all in April.

[White Cornerback]

These expansion rules are whack.

Both GM's are taken in the expansion, but the teams still take 12 more players? That's 14 players before one of the largest drafts, and that's not taking into account any free agents they sign. I would have liked to see 8-9 players + GM's.

And they get slotted at the top of the draft order? They should be slotted 3 and 4. Absolutely ruining the teams that expected a high draft pick and may not get their guy/position and will be perpetual bottom feeders.

A team can lose up to 3 of their guys? Whack. I'd like to see that brought down to 2.

HO should take a look at the NBA's expansion rules because our league is most similar to that in terms of contract length and team size.

I know I'm not around a lot, but it also would have been nice to get a decline notice or any kind of notice of my application, but I understand ho is busy and doesn't want to waste energy on someone who stops by once a month to stir the pot.

Aight. See y'all in April.

[siddhus]

These expansion rules are whack.

Both GM's are taken in the expansion, but the teams still take 12 more players? That's 14 players before one of the largest drafts, and that's not taking into account any free agents they sign. I would have liked to see 8-9 players + GM's.

And they get slotted at the top of the draft order? They should be slotted 3 and 4. Absolutely ruining the teams that expected a high draft pick and may not get their guy/position and will be perpetual bottom feeders.

A team can lose up to 3 of their guys? Whack. I'd like to see that brought down to 2.

HO should take a look at the NBA's expansion rules because our league is most similar to that in terms of contract length and team size.

I know I'm not around a lot, but it also would have been nice to get a decline notice or any kind of notice of my application, but I understand ho is busy and doesn't want to waste energy on someone who stops by once a month to stir the pot.

Aight. See y'all in April.

If anything look at MLS Expansion rules lol. NBA expansion is for a 12 person team where 5 play at once. Soccer is 11 on the field which is like football. And also when was the last time NBA even did expansion lol.

Quote from MlS: Here's how the process will work on Tuesday. Both clubs will each be able to select up to five players currently on MLS teams. All teams will now be able to protect 12 players after previously being allowed to place 11 on their protected lists.

To adjust that to NSFL i would say 5 picked per team and 6 protects and 3 taken per team.

Also just a disclaimer this is a response to ur statement, I completely agree with expansion rules set in place by HO

[ADwyer87]

These expansion rules are whack.

Both GM's are taken in the expansion, but the teams still take 12 more players? That's 14 players before one of the largest drafts, and that's not taking into account any free agents they sign. I would have liked to see 8-9 players + GM's.

And they get slotted at the top of the draft order? They should be slotted 3 and 4. Absolutely ruining the teams that expected a high draft pick and may not get their guy/position and will be perpetual bottom feeders.

A team can lose up to 3 of their guys? Whack. I'd like to see that brought down to 2.

HO should take a look at the NBA's expansion rules because our league is most similar to that in terms of contract length and team size.

I know I'm not around a lot, but it also would have been nice to get a decline notice or any kind of notice of my application, but I understand ho is busy and doesn't want to waste energy on someone who stops by once a month to stir the pot.

Aight. See y'all in April.

So youd like to create dead expansion teams? Noted

[sapp2013]

If anything look at MLS Expansion rules lol. NBA expansion is for a 12 person team where 5 play at once. Soccer is 11 on the field which is like football. And also when was the last time NBA even did expansion lol.

Quote from MlS: Here's how the process will work on Tuesday. Both clubs will each be able to select up to five players currently on MLS teams. All teams will now be able to protect 12 players after previously being allowed to place 11 on their protected lists.

To adjust that to NSFL i would say 5 picked per team and 6 protects and 3 taken per team.

Also just a disclaimer this is a response to ur statement, I completely agree with expansion rules set in place by HO

NBA rosters have 15 players on them plus two two-way contracts. Last expansion for NBA was in 2004 (Charlotte Bobcats, now Hornets), but the G-League expanded 12 times since 2006 and follows the same expansion rules (afaik), so it is quite relevant.

I admit I know next to nothing about the MLS and how the league operates, but you cant just say 11 = 11 here. first, NSFL has bot and inactive players. sure, they take up cap room, space on a roster, and a position on the field, but they add nothing to a lockerroom. Second, looking at a couple NSFL rosters, most are sitting between 18 and 22 players. I think it would be fair to say 80% of players are active, so we are looking at an active lockerroom of 14.4-17.6 players, right around that NBA roster number.

looking at the 2019 MLS Expansion rules (which looks like what you have above), I am fine with them, but I still think this league reflects better against the NBA and I feel more people know about the NBA rules than the MLS. My biggest qualm is the amount of players that the new teams get. If it is reduced, the number of total players that can be taken from each team can then go down to 2. We dont want to penalize a team for building correctly just to get torn apart by a new team because they need players.

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@ADwyer87 because I posted about 31 seconds after you, if you think a team of 10 players with none retiring and none leaving in Free agency BEFORE a large draft and signing their own Free agents is dead, then you have way too high of standard. May just be the nostalgia hitting me, but I remember a 7-man active lockerroom based out of philly winning an ultimus. Not saying a 7 man active lockerroom is ideal or even on-par, but my proposal is not as far out as you think.

[ADwyer87]

@ADwyer87 because I posted about 31 seconds after you, if you think a team of 10 players with none retiring and none leaving in Free agency BEFORE a large draft and signing their own Free agents is dead, then you have way too high of standard. May just be the nostalgia hitting me, but I remember a 7-man active lockerroom based out of philly winning an ultimus. Not saying a 7 man active lockerroom is ideal or even on-par, but my proposal is not as far out as you think.

I sould say its incredibly far out. Youre just punishing expansion teams in a situation that is already harsher than the last expansion rules. I get that you "protect other teams here" but as is based on my preliminary looks based on the preliminary looks theres an incredibly small chance with these rules that we get 7 actives each from this draft, maybe 7 actives total. And any actives we are getting are either mid earners or regressing guys (still very valuable users for a locker room but less so for an expansion franchise).

We are essentially getting the 8th best, 10th best, and 12th best players from each team. And i think thats fair, just to be clear. But i think looking at that its crazy to think the rules are too easy for expansion teams. Its a good level of harsh, obviously imma take what i can get being one of the said expansion teams but either way im not upset with those rules.

Take the 8th, 10th, and 12th best player from each NFL team and youre not gonna make the playoffs. Do it from the XFL and that team is winless. Do it in the NBA and most you would be lucky to win 10 games. Again, i agree eith the rules, but i think copying an NBA system is insane for a league like ours

[sapp2013]

I sould say its incredibly far out. Youre just punishing expansion teams in a situation that is already harsher than the last expansion rules. I get that you "protect other teams here" but as is based on my preliminary looks based on the preliminary looks theres an incredibly small chance with these rules that we get 7 actives each from this draft, maybe 7 actives total. And any actives we are getting are either mid earners or regressing guys (still very valuable users for a locker room but less so for an expansion franchise).

We are essentially getting the 8th best, 10th best, and 12th best players from each team. And i think thats fair, just to be clear. But i think looking at that its crazy to think the rules are too easy for expansion teams. Its a good level of harsh, obviously imma take what i can get being one of the said expansion teams but either way im not upset with those rules.

Take the 8th, 10th, and 12th best player from each NFL team and youre not gonna make the playoffs. Do it from the XFL and that team is winless. Do it in the NBA and most you would be lucky to win 10 games. Again, i agree eith the rules, but i think copying an NBA system is insane for a league like ours

regarding the 8th, 10th, 12th comment, assuming all teams are balanced TPE wise (which they arent, but I am not digging into that info) really only the 8th and 10th players would be selected with 1 or 2 12th players. also, each team gets presumably 2 high TPE earners because of the GMs. the teams also get rookies and can sign any free agent that wants to go there.

regarding the NFL comment, you could make a decent team with those parameters. using this website I looked at the first 4 teams on the list, Vikings, rams, dolphins, and Chargers. These were the overalls of the 8,10,and 12 of each team in overall order: 86, 85, 85, 84, 83, 82, 82, 81, 79, 78, 76, 76. I'd be happy with that pull and could do some damage with it. the reason why this pull isnt bad is because how the NFL did it back in 2002 was they could list any 5 players from their roster, and those were the only players you could choose from. That in my mind is way stricter than what I was looking for and probably why the texans struggled so much to make their first playoff appearance.

according to the 2017 NHL Expansion draft, you could protect 9 or 11 players depending on strategy. the NHL has a 23 active roster, so just under 50% are protected, but the expansion team could only take 1 player per team (30 original teams). the Golden Knights went on to the cup finals in their first year, so its not a death penalty by any means to take players outside of a teams top 8 players.

[ADwyer87]

regarding the 8th, 10th, 12th comment, assuming all teams are balanced TPE wise (which they arent, but I am not digging into that info) really only the 8th and 10th players would be selected with 1 or 2 12th players. also, each team gets presumably 2 high TPE earners because of the GMs. the teams also get rookies and can sign any free agent that wants to go there.

regarding the NFL comment, you could make a decent team with those parameters. using this website I looked at the first 4 teams on the list, Vikings, rams, dolphins, and Chargers. These were the overalls of the 8,10,and 12 of each team in overall order: 86, 85, 85, 84, 83, 82, 82, 81, 79, 78, 76, 76. I'd be happy with that pull and could do some damage with it. the reason why this pull isnt bad is because how the NFL did it back in 2002 was they could list any 5 players from their roster, and those were the only players you could choose from. That in my mind is way stricter than what I was looking for and probably why the texans struggled so much to make their first playoff appearance.

according to the 2017 NHL Expansion draft, you could protect 9 or 11 players depending on strategy.  the NHL has a 23 active roster, so just under 50% are protected, but the expansion team could only take 1 player per team (30 original teams). the Golden Knights went on to the cup finals in their first year, so its not a death penalty by any means to take players outside of a teams top 8 players.

I think its hard to do a comparison with madden numbers. Either way first of all we are not quite set up with talent like the NFL is, but still i doubt a team like that would perform as well on the field as you could do in madden.

As for the NHL, i think thats just not a good comparison because that draft still is weird to me to this day, and also just that as far as how the sport works. You couldnt compare the NHL to any NFL rules, let alone the NSFL. Taking a guy outside of the top 8 in hockey isnt anywhere as close as outside the top 8 in football. I think similar thing with your NBA example.

But i think on the flip side, your argument seems to be that its ok with your rules, but the current rules are for some reason crazy? If memory serves right, we did 6 protections last time, and could take 4 players from each team, a year of buikd up before starting play, and still having top picks the year they open operations. Austin just won the championship after staring their first season winless, putting together r straight losing seasons, ans finally coming up big thanks to many good moves, they certainly didnt just have a good expansion and rest on those laurels to victory. If thats what you view as too easy i just cant agree there. Then Chicago went full win now, had some early success and now are still working to build back up. So with some other leagues we can say hey, maybe its not too bad, though i disagree with how you can interpret that. But with direct NSFL comparisons i dont see how this is crazy at all, and not sure how your proposed rules dont just subjext anyone drafted to these teams with no real hope of seeing success

[ADwyer87]

just looking at things, judging by just APE, this is what would be the draft pool

S14 QB 1258 TPE#*

S18 RB 541 TPE
S18 RB 782 TPE
S15 RB 543 TPE*
S19 RB 278 TPE
S21 RB 398 TPE#

S18 WR 456 TPE
S19 WR 633 TPE#
S18 WR 679 TPE

S19 TE 712 TPE
S13 TE 510 TPE*

S15 DE 462 TPE*
S18 DT 308 TPE
S18 DE 523 TPE
S15 DT 606 TPE*
S18 DT 734 TPE

S15 LB 519 TPE*
S14 LB 556 TPE*
S15 LB 729 TPE*
S18 LB 287 TPE
S20 LB 312 TPE

S15 CB 674 TPE*
S20 CB 479 TPE
S19 CB 706 TPE

S15 S 631 TPE*
S10 S 495 TPE*
S20 S 336 TPE
S20 S 420 TPE
S13 S 363 TPE*

S14 K 445 TPE*

* = in regression AKA this wont be their TPE value come draft time, # = GM player. I think this is a fair draft pool and HO did a good job. I'm also sure it's not as easy as just top 7 players in TPE, but I think this is a fair assessment. GMs will split this pool and then add in S22 rookies. Its filler boost and some active help, what I would say an expansion should be. i just dont see how that can be seen as too much

anyways i did more research for this than I thought I would lol