The Asterisk Game

[loco]

there's something so strange about some dude with a "but she persisted" signature and apparently a fuckin folder full of gifs of random girls

[RavensFanFromOntario]

Jiggly, just step down.

[JuOSu]

I don't really care one way or another but I will say that agreeing to sim again and then not accepting the results cause you don't like it seems like a dangerous precedent to set. In the future, what is stopping an NSFL team from doing the same? How come there are no rules in place for this? How come people complaining can sway the decision of the HO?

[37thchamber]

agreeing to sim again and then not accepting the results cause you don't like it seems like a dangerous precedent to set.

Pretty sure that's not what happened though, according to what Jiggly says here. The final re-sim was because the previous one failed to save. It was a necessary re-sim. There was no "agreeing to sim again" because there was no choice in the matter.

The issue, from what I can tell, is that Jiggly's thinking is "the original results shouldn't have stood anyway because my roster was ineligible, the final one is the only valid result", whereas the Marshals take the stance "the result prior to the forced re-sim should stand, since that's what would have happened if the sim hadn't failed to save"

It would appear that there is a precedent to be either set or followed here. And once it's done, the HO need to codify it and make it clear what the decision was, and why. Then we can all move on. *shrug*

[JuOSu]

Pretty sure that's not what happened though, according to what Jiggly says here. The final re-sim was because the previous one failed to save. It was a necessary re-sim. There was no "agreeing to sim again" because there was no choice in the matter.

The issue, from what I can tell, is that Jiggly's thinking is "the original results shouldn't have stood anyway because my roster was ineligible, the final one is the only valid result", whereas the Marshals take the stance "the result prior to the forced re-sim should stand, since that's what would have happened if the sim hadn't failed to save"

It would appear that there is a precedent to be either set or followed here. And once it's done, the HO need to codify it and make it clear what the decision was, and why. Then we can all move on. *shrug*

Yeah, I am not necessarily saying that either of them is right. I don't think either of their arguments is very good. It had to be re-simmed and there should have been a clear judgment before the sim whether or not the new sim would count or the old one. We can't sim and then afterwards decide oh this was just done cause it failed, the original result counted all along. The decision should have been clear before the game.

[37thchamber]

We can't sim and then afterwards decide oh this was just done cause it failed, the original result counted all along. The decision should have been clear before the game.

Well, the decision was clear before the second game. Everyone was happy to move on after game two. Again, Jiggly says as much. The second sim, for all intents and purposes, should have been the final one.

It seems to me that the only reason this is even up for debate at all is because rosters were changed between sim two and the unforeseen necessity of sim three, so now game two is no longer the final legitimate sim.

That's where the fuck up is. There has been an oversight by the HO/simmers, from what I can tell. Nobody considered the implications of introducing another variable, so now they have to make a call (which it appears they have), and yes, this decision should have been made clear prior to the third sim.

But it wasn't. So now it needs to be clarified and codified for future reference. That way, if the situation arises again, everyone knows where they stand, and there are no arguments.

[White Cornerback]

@ErMurazor can confirm. The sim corrupts quite regularly regardless of if changes have been made or not. There is no confirmation that removing or adding the user Dusty Atkins to the sim made it corrupt. This engine is fundamentally broken and it's not something we can ever hope to fix. We are limited by the lack of effort from developers of Wolverine Studios and regardless of what happened, their is no reason to sling mud at other users regardless of your personal feelings for them.

[kckolbe]

What pissed me off was what a no-brainer this was. Not only was there a precedent already for this, but the last time this happened it took ZERO time to take in.

Season Two: Week 12, San Jose SaberCats AT Yellowknife. In a low-scoring game, the Cats barely won in OT, despite being on the road and against a better team (by TPE, record, PD, etc). The Wraiths were immediately informed that because the results weren't saved there would be a re-sim, but that the results would be the SAME. There was no chance of winning. We had to sit and watch our team BARELY lose twice, the second time knowing what to expect. Now, if you simmed that game 100 times, the Wraiths would have won a little over 80 of them. However, because we lost that first sim, we AUTOMATICALLY lost the second.

When it was announced there would have to be a re-sim, I didn't care because this precedent was well in mind. Jiggly asked if he could have Atasuke put in the sim, and I had no issue with it because it meant stats going to a legal player and not a bot. I knew that Jiggly cared about keeping players engaged and probably was trying to get Atasuke involved somehow. That's his thing. I agreed to THAT. However, I agreed to it knowing that the end result would not be changed because there was already an existing precedent.

Now, to @`Dermot` and @Sweetwater, you've both done a lot for this site, and Dermot HAS been a great DSFL asset, and Sweet has been great to me, personally. But we are in the Thunderdome.

To the Head Office: EAT ALL THE DICKS.

The Marshals/Blues game was simmed at 5:04 PM PST and it was discovered immediately that the game didn't save. An announcement of the ruling (again, for a precedent that had ALREADY been set) didn't come down until 7:21 PST...TWO HOURS AND 17 MINUTES LATER. During that time, there were ZERO posts by HO members in the DSFL discord. Do me a favor, imagine this happening to an NSFL game and waiting that long with NOTHING in between. You can't, can you?

Once the ruling was announced, THEN HO popped in to tell us how fucking disappointed you were with our behavior and how we should have reached out to you on the site. Tough shit. When YOU stop doing your job, you don't get to bitch about how others did it in your place.

Speaking of reaching out on the site, I tagged @7hawk77 with a rules question that affected EVERY DSFL team on 3 November regarding inactive OL. He didn't respond until 6 November. The justification for this, according to Sweetwater, was that he "wanted to check with the rest of the HO first to make sure he told [me] the right rule." I call bullshit.

First off, Hawk does NOT have a record of making sure he understands something before posting it (see: Legion salary/bet announcement). Second, if that's the case, respond and say "I'll get back to you, need to check." I'm not surprised that he wouldn't do this, as Hawk has demonstrated that he cares more about being seen as an authority than actually being of service to the people (again, see the Legion thread where he says he refuses to discuss a ruling that EVERY commenter present felt was too harsh).

Here's the really fucked up part, though. The OL announcement was made on 23 October. I asked a clarification question on 3 November. That's a week and a half after everything had been sorted out enough to announce it, and that still hadn't been figured out? And it took 3 fucking days?

So, Hawk is slow to respond in forums, not a presence in discord, out of touch with the league, and not service-focused. AND HE GETS PAID. Head Office, keep an eye on this shit. However, only Dermot has been significantly better in terms of working with the DSFL to get processes and rulings official in a prompt, helpful manner.

Now, to @Jiggly_333. You "no longer" care about winning? No longer? As in, you did care? Did you care during the two offseasons where you updated the spreadsheet ZERO times? Did you care when the OL buffs, which I announced to the DSFL discord to make sure everyone knew, were announced? Did you care when you spent a second round pick on a kicker, AND HE WASN'T EVEN THE MOST ACTIVE KICKER. If you had drafted @run_CMC in the second, I would have fucking cheered. That is a cool guy, and would have been a great team member for you.

I can forgive you just being a shitty GM, but your fucking grandstanding that all I care about is winning while you care about the players...game on.

As the GM of the Blues, you paid your own character 4 million. You had ACTIVE players that you only paid 1 million, which is the lowest OF ALL DSFL TEAMS. Even the Marshals, who have the LARGEST NUMBER OF ACTIVE PLAYERS, BY THE WAY, paid every active player more than DOUBLE THAT (exception is @pulsedk, who messaged us offering to take the minimum to help his teammates). The fact that you claim to be the player advocate when you screw your own players over financially makes you the biggest fucking hypocrite in the league. I'm amazed you were even allowed to remain as a GM. Okay, that isn't true. It doesn't surprise me at all. But five seasons from now, when the head office finally realizes what a piece of shit you've been and takes action, DON'T BE SURPRISED.

Also, which team is more active? Have you enjoyed the podcasts that @Roly hosts, invariably involving teammates? Have you seen all the PTs the team has been doing? Do you know why? Because @iamslm22 and I set the fucking bar to do them. We contact EVERY player when they create, welcome them, offer to answer questions. After the draft, we show them out depth charts, explain our strategies, give suggestions on build. Both Slim and I offered to grant interviews to any teammate and let them keep the payout. We help them improve.

Also, if accusing us of only trying to win, maybe you should look at our depth chart. Last year, the Marshals had Isaiah Rashad as a CB, which he was awesome at, and we still have him. This year we acquired Jorge Masvidal and Rafael Reyes as well in the later rounds of the supplemental draft. Uh oh! Too many DBs! We had already drafted Gregory Fletcher and Darren Morris, as well as acquired Michael Tillman as the first waiver pick up (they are all DBs, btw). That gave us SIX DBs. Naturally, since Rashad, Reyes, and Masvidal were all over 100 TPE, and all I care about is winning, I told our active rookies to get acquainted with the bench, right?

Wrong! I moved Rashad to LB, where he is a "meh" fit, started all three active players, put Masvidal in the one remaining starting DB role, and put Reyes #2 in all formations. I then wrote this huge ass post in the locker room explaining WHY Reyes was on the bench, and telling them that as long as they were active, they would remain starters. I let them play, but also let them know that success wasn't free. They would need to maintain that effort.

Last year, I spent all season watching GMs fail to do their jobs and get rewarded by still getting their players. Even this season, did I bitch when Atkins was on the field? No, I pointed it out, and was told it would be fixed for the NEXT game. This was in the first quarter. For all I knew, I could have lost that game. Hey, mistakes, right?

All right, I'm done now. I no longer care about something as well. Jiggly, I *did* care about you, because I used to think you had a good heart. You don't, though. You are so focused on bitching about your own situation that you care NOTHING for others. Your biggest argument in discord for getting other people to do your job (which, by the way, Er did for a while) was that things were too bad for you. I WAS PREPARING TO BE COURT-MARTIALED FOR BEING AWOL DESPITE HAVING NOTIFIED MY SUPERIORS WHILE ALSO BEING SCHEDULED FOR MANDATORY THERAPY SESSIONS BECAUSE I WAS ACCUSED OF RAPE EVEN THOUGH THE INVESTIGATION CLEARED ME. You think MY week has been easy?

[iamslm22]

What pissed me off was what a no-brainer this was.  Not only was there a precedent already for this, but the last time this happened it took ZERO time to take in.

Season Two: Week 12, San Jose SaberCats AT Yellowknife.  In a low-scoring game, the Cats barely won in OT, despite being on the road and against a better team (by TPE, record, PD, etc).  The Wraiths were immediately informed that because the results weren't saved there would be a re-sim, but that the results would be the SAME.  There was no chance of winning.  We had to sit and watch our team BARELY lose twice, the second time knowing what to expect.  Now, if you simmed that game 100 times, the Wraiths would have won a little over 80 of them.  However, because we lost that first sim, we AUTOMATICALLY lost the second. 

When it was announced there would have to be a re-sim, I didn't care because this precedent was well in mind.  Jiggly asked if he could have Atasuke put in the sim, and I had no issue with it because it meant stats going to a legal player and not a bot.  I knew that Jiggly cared about keeping players engaged and probably was trying to get Atasuke involved somehow.  That's his thing.  I agreed to THAT.  However, I agreed to it knowing that the end result would not be changed because there was already an existing precedent.

Now, to @`Dermot` and @Sweetwater, you've both done a lot for this site, and Dermot HAS been a great DSFL asset, and Sweet has been great to me, personally.  But we are in the Thunderdome.

To the Head Office: EAT ALL THE DICKS.

The Marshals/Blues game was simmed at 5:04 PM PST and it was discovered immediately that the game didn't save.  An announcement of the ruling (again, for a precedent that had ALREADY been set) didn't come down until 7:21 PST...TWO HOURS AND 17 MINUTES LATER.  During that time, there were ZERO posts by HO members in the DSFL discord.  Do me a favor, imagine this happening to an NSFL game and waiting that long with NOTHING in between.  You can't, can you?

Once the ruling was announced, THEN HO popped in to tell us how fucking disappointed you were with our behavior and how we should have reached out to you on the site.  Tough shit.  When YOU stop doing your job, you don't get to bitch about how others did it in your place. 

Speaking of reaching out on the site, I tagged @7hawk77 with a rules question that affected EVERY DSFL team on 3 November regarding inactive OL.  He didn't respond until 6 November.  The justification for this, according to Sweetwater, was that he "wanted to check with the rest of the HO first to make sure he told [me] the right rule."  I call bullshit.

First off, Hawk does NOT have a record of making sure he understands something before posting it (see: Legion salary/bet announcement).  Second, if that's the case, respond and say "I'll get back to you, need to check."  I'm not surprised that he wouldn't do this, as Hawk has demonstrated that he cares more about being seen as an authority than actually being of service to the people (again, see the Legion thread where he says he refuses to discuss a ruling that EVERY commenter present felt was too harsh). 

Here's the really fucked up part, though.  The OL announcement was made on 23 October.  I asked a clarification question on 3 November.  That's a week and a half after everything had been sorted out enough to announce it, and that still hadn't been figured out?  And it took 3 fucking days? 

So, Hawk is slow to respond in forums, not a presence in discord, out of touch with the league, and not service-focused.  AND HE GETS PAID.  Head Office, keep an eye on this shit.  However, only Dermot has been significantly better in terms of working with the DSFL to get processes and rulings official in a prompt, helpful manner.

Now, to @Jiggly_333.  You "no longer" care about winning?  No longer?  As in, you did care?  Did you care during the two offseasons where you updated the spreadsheet ZERO times?  Did you care when the OL buffs, which I announced to the DSFL discord  to make sure everyone knew, were announced?  Did you care when you spent a second round pick on a kicker, AND HE WASN'T EVEN THE MOST ACTIVE KICKER.  If you had drafted @run_CMC in the second, I would have fucking cheered.  That is a cool guy, and would have been a great team member for you.

I can forgive you just being a shitty GM, but your fucking grandstanding that all I care about is winning while you care about the players...game on.

As the GM of the Blues, you paid your own character 4 million.  You had ACTIVE players that you only paid 1 million, which is the lowest OF ALL DSFL TEAMS.  Even the Marshals, who have the LARGEST NUMBER OF ACTIVE PLAYERS, BY THE WAY, paid every active player more than DOUBLE THAT (exception is @pulsedk, who messaged us offering to take the minimum to help his teammates).  The fact that you claim to be the player advocate when you screw your own players over financially makes you the biggest fucking hypocrite in the league.  I'm amazed you were even allowed to remain as a GM.  Okay, that isn't true.  It doesn't surprise me at all.  But five seasons from now, when the head office finally realizes what a piece of shit you've been and takes action, DON'T BE SURPRISED.

Also, which team is more active?  Have you enjoyed the podcasts that @Roly hosts, invariably involving teammates?  Have you seen all the PTs the team has been doing?  Do you know why?  Because @iamslm22 and I set the fucking bar to do them.  We contact EVERY player when they create, welcome them, offer to answer questions.  After the draft, we show them out depth charts, explain our strategies, give suggestions on build.  Both Slim and I offered to grant interviews to any teammate and let them keep the payout.  We help them improve.

Also, if accusing us of only trying to win, maybe you should look at our depth chart.  Last year, the Marshals had Isaiah Rashad as a CB, which he was awesome at, and we still have him.  This year we acquired Jorge Masvidal and Rafael Reyes as well in the later rounds of the supplemental draft.  Uh oh!  Too many DBs!  We had already drafted Gregory Fletcher and Darren Morris, as well as acquired Michael Tillman as the first waiver pick up (they are all DBs, btw).  That gave us SIX DBs.  Naturally, since Rashad, Reyes, and Masvidal were all over 100 TPE, and all I care about is winning, I told our active rookies to get acquainted with the bench, right? 

Wrong!  I moved Rashad to LB, where he is a "meh" fit, started all three active players, put Masvidal in the one remaining starting DB role, and put Reyes #2 in all formations.  I then wrote this huge ass post in the locker room explaining WHY Reyes was on the bench, and telling them that as long as they were active, they would remain starters.  I let them play, but also let them know that success wasn't free.  They would need to maintain that effort.

Last year, I spent all season watching GMs fail to do their jobs and get rewarded by still getting their players.  Even this season, did I bitch when Atkins was on the field?  No, I pointed it out, and was told it would be fixed for the NEXT game.  This was in the first quarter.  For all I knew, I could have lost that game.  Hey, mistakes, right?

All right, I'm done now.  I no longer care about something as well.  Jiggly, I *did* care about you, because I used to think you had a good heart.  You don't, though.  You are so focused on bitching about your own situation that you care NOTHING for others.  Your biggest argument in discord for getting other people to do your job (which, by the way, Er did for a while) was that things were too bad for you.  I WAS PREPARING TO BE COURT-MARTIALED  FOR BEING AWOL DESPITE HAVING NOTIFIED MY SUPERIORS WHILE ALSO BEING SCHEDULED FOR MANDATORY THERAPY SESSIONS BECAUSE I WAS ACCUSED OF RAPE EVEN THOUGH THE INVESTIGATION CLEARED ME.  You think MY week has been easy?

For the record, I co-sign this. Jiggly as a wise man once said, you come at the king, you best not miss.

[bovovovo]

What pissed me off was what a no-brainer this was.  Not only was there a precedent already for this, but the last time this happened it took ZERO time to take in.

Season Two: Week 12, San Jose SaberCats AT Yellowknife.  In a low-scoring game, the Cats barely won in OT, despite being on the road and against a better team (by TPE, record, PD, etc).  The Wraiths were immediately informed that because the results weren't saved there would be a re-sim, but that the results would be the SAME.  There was no chance of winning.  We had to sit and watch our team BARELY lose twice, the second time knowing what to expect.  Now, if you simmed that game 100 times, the Wraiths would have won a little over 80 of them.  However, because we lost that first sim, we AUTOMATICALLY lost the second. 

When it was announced there would have to be a re-sim, I didn't care because this precedent was well in mind.  Jiggly asked if he could have Atasuke put in the sim, and I had no issue with it because it meant stats going to a legal player and not a bot.  I knew that Jiggly cared about keeping players engaged and probably was trying to get Atasuke involved somehow.  That's his thing.  I agreed to THAT.  However, I agreed to it knowing that the end result would not be changed because there was already an existing precedent.

Now, to @`Dermot` and @Sweetwater, you've both done a lot for this site, and Dermot HAS been a great DSFL asset, and Sweet has been great to me, personally.  But we are in the Thunderdome.

To the Head Office: EAT ALL THE DICKS.

The Marshals/Blues game was simmed at 5:04 PM PST and it was discovered immediately that the game didn't save.  An announcement of the ruling (again, for a precedent that had ALREADY been set) didn't come down until 7:21 PST...TWO HOURS AND 17 MINUTES LATER.  During that time, there were ZERO posts by HO members in the DSFL discord.  Do me a favor, imagine this happening to an NSFL game and waiting that long with NOTHING in between.  You can't, can you?

Once the ruling was announced, THEN HO popped in to tell us how fucking disappointed you were with our behavior and how we should have reached out to you on the site.  Tough shit.  When YOU stop doing your job, you don't get to bitch about how others did it in your place. 

Speaking of reaching out on the site, I tagged @7hawk77 with a rules question that affected EVERY DSFL team on 3 November regarding inactive OL.  He didn't respond until 6 November.  The justification for this, according to Sweetwater, was that he "wanted to check with the rest of the HO first to make sure he told [me] the right rule."  I call bullshit.

First off, Hawk does NOT have a record of making sure he understands something before posting it (see: Legion salary/bet announcement).  Second, if that's the case, respond and say "I'll get back to you, need to check."  I'm not surprised that he wouldn't do this, as Hawk has demonstrated that he cares more about being seen as an authority than actually being of service to the people (again, see the Legion thread where he says he refuses to discuss a ruling that EVERY commenter present felt was too harsh). 

Here's the really fucked up part, though.  The OL announcement was made on 23 October.  I asked a clarification question on 3 November.  That's a week and a half after everything had been sorted out enough to announce it, and that still hadn't been figured out?  And it took 3 fucking days? 

So, Hawk is slow to respond in forums, not a presence in discord, out of touch with the league, and not service-focused.  AND HE GETS PAID.  Head Office, keep an eye on this shit.  However, only Dermot has been significantly better in terms of working with the DSFL to get processes and rulings official in a prompt, helpful manner.

Now, to @Jiggly_333.  You "no longer" care about winning?  No longer?  As in, you did care?  Did you care during the two offseasons where you updated the spreadsheet ZERO times?  Did you care when the OL buffs, which I announced to the DSFL discord  to make sure everyone knew, were announced?  Did you care when you spent a second round pick on a kicker, AND HE WASN'T EVEN THE MOST ACTIVE KICKER.  If you had drafted @run_CMC in the second, I would have fucking cheered.  That is a cool guy, and would have been a great team member for you.

I can forgive you just being a shitty GM, but your fucking grandstanding that all I care about is winning while you care about the players...game on.

As the GM of the Blues, you paid your own character 4 million.  You had ACTIVE players that you only paid 1 million, which is the lowest OF ALL DSFL TEAMS.  Even the Marshals, who have the LARGEST NUMBER OF ACTIVE PLAYERS, BY THE WAY, paid every active player more than DOUBLE THAT (exception is @pulsedk, who messaged us offering to take the minimum to help his teammates).  The fact that you claim to be the player advocate when you screw your own players over financially makes you the biggest fucking hypocrite in the league.  I'm amazed you were even allowed to remain as a GM.  Okay, that isn't true.  It doesn't surprise me at all.  But five seasons from now, when the head office finally realizes what a piece of shit you've been and takes action, DON'T BE SURPRISED.

Also, which team is more active?  Have you enjoyed the podcasts that @Roly hosts, invariably involving teammates?  Have you seen all the PTs the team has been doing?  Do you know why?  Because @iamslm22 and I set the fucking bar to do them.  We contact EVERY player when they create, welcome them, offer to answer questions.  After the draft, we show them out depth charts, explain our strategies, give suggestions on build.  Both Slim and I offered to grant interviews to any teammate and let them keep the payout.  We help them improve.

Also, if accusing us of only trying to win, maybe you should look at our depth chart.  Last year, the Marshals had Isaiah Rashad as a CB, which he was awesome at, and we still have him.  This year we acquired Jorge Masvidal and Rafael Reyes as well in the later rounds of the supplemental draft.  Uh oh!  Too many DBs!  We had already drafted Gregory Fletcher and Darren Morris, as well as acquired Michael Tillman as the first waiver pick up (they are all DBs, btw).  That gave us SIX DBs.  Naturally, since Rashad, Reyes, and Masvidal were all over 100 TPE, and all I care about is winning, I told our active rookies to get acquainted with the bench, right? 

Wrong!  I moved Rashad to LB, where he is a "meh" fit, started all three active players, put Masvidal in the one remaining starting DB role, and put Reyes #2 in all formations.  I then wrote this huge ass post in the locker room explaining WHY Reyes was on the bench, and telling them that as long as they were active, they would remain starters.  I let them play, but also let them know that success wasn't free.  They would need to maintain that effort.

Last year, I spent all season watching GMs fail to do their jobs and get rewarded by still getting their players.  Even this season, did I bitch when Atkins was on the field?  No, I pointed it out, and was told it would be fixed for the NEXT game.  This was in the first quarter.  For all I knew, I could have lost that game.  Hey, mistakes, right?

All right, I'm done now.  I no longer care about something as well.  Jiggly, I *did* care about you, because I used to think you had a good heart.  You don't, though.  You are so focused on bitching about your own situation that you care NOTHING for others.  Your biggest argument in discord for getting other people to do your job (which, by the way, Er did for a while) was that things were too bad for you.  I WAS PREPARING TO BE COURT-MARTIALED  FOR BEING AWOL DESPITE HAVING NOTIFIED MY SUPERIORS WHILE ALSO BEING SCHEDULED FOR MANDATORY THERAPY SESSIONS BECAUSE I WAS ACCUSED OF RAPE EVEN THOUGH THE INVESTIGATION CLEARED ME.  You think MY week has been easy?

+1-ing a lot of this. DSFL is all about getting new members to the site and league acclimated and welcomed, and having a DSFL GM that simultaneously complains about everything and is a lame duck is definitely not the way to do that.

Outside of my man Dermot, in my experience both as a DSFL co-gm and an outsider, it looks like the HO isn’t taking the DSFL nearly as seriously as they should be. Maybe hire another HO or two? Because it’s honestly pretty bad and not a good look for the league, especially when (again) the whole point of the DSFL is to get new players more involved and having fun quicker.

EDIT: I do still think that generally the HO is doing a good job, but the DSFL needs help imo